On the whole I'm in agreement with what you're saying. I dunno if I'd like to see a ball in hand situation after a foul; but that said, you're talking about deliberate fouls there, and again it would be impossible for the game software to judge.

There ya go! The advantage wasn't positional, it was psychological. We're all aware of what to do in most (normal) situations in a game of UK 8 ball. If a clearance is possible, go for it. If it's dodgy but your opponent will clear if you miss, go for it or play a safety. If you cannot pot, play it safe or go for a fluke depending on a number of factors, etc etc. But when your opponent leaves you scratching your head thinking "What do I do now???" and you end up losing the frame, the tactic works. Any, any tactic that gives you the win is a worthwhile one (except if you PM the other guy mid-shot, physically interfere with him/her if they're nearby, that sort of thing).




Thank you sir!



I hear ya... Imagine if UK and US 8 ball had a rule that on the first shot after a foul the incoming player could legally hit any ball (already there in UK 8 ball, of course) and also pot the black and win the frame. This would, by definition, include aiming...

Edited at 22:27 Wed 15/10/08 (BST)

...directly at the black and potting it. Or if in 9 ball, after a foul, you could hit any ball you wanted, thereby allowing you to pot the 9 directly for the win. All three games, while mad, would be ruined.

No I actually meant ball in hand after any foul - but as a consequence that may devalue the objective of a deliberate foul. Purely an example though - not a proposal.

Potting an opponent ball if it's a blocking ball is perfectly sounds tactics, AND you should normally try to do it as soon as possible. The more balls left on the table at the time you do it, the more chances of getting back on the table.

If you play 8 ball and block a pocket the opponent needs open, vs. the better players you will experience your ball getting pocketed immediately, 100 of 100 times. Because it's sound tactics, and you want to take that loss sooner than later, since the more balls left on the table, the more chance of getting back on after making the foul.

When someone blocks a pocket on you, they are doing a strategically sound move. When you respond in the only sensible way to avoid losing the game for sure, you are likewise making a stragically sound move - foul or not.

In short, you have absolutely no reason what so ever to be grumpy about your opponent dropping one of your own balls. Not in any case, and most definitely not when you have chosen to make that ball strategically important to both players.

Hey jan i agree with what your saying above and i'm honestly not being grumpy about this, just saying I was a bit surprised whilst playing as I'd never seen this happen before on the UK game as the penalty of 2 shot carry is quite severe. I for instance would not know when to play this shot on the UK game as I would look stupid when the opponent clears.

I agree that potting an opponents ball is totally fair game. When I first started playing 8 ball US I remember playing cityan84 and he was just intent on blocking the corner pockets and I didn't really know what to do apart from move my balls away up the table towards other pockets. Funky dave also did this against me. Now when someone does this I generally just cannon one of my balls onto the opponents which is over the pocket to cover it with my ball. Just have to have a quick glance round to ensure he/she can't clear up using the other pockets, so yeah jan doing it as early as possible is best. Didn't really want to raise this point on here as it is amazing how many players don't do this when I am playing them, makes it so much easier.

If you play me on 8 US you will see I'm quite defensive because its generally hard to clear in one visit, so I sometimes spend time at the start of a game just getting awkward balls off the cushions, covering pockets etc... On uk however its hard to miss at times so I was just impressed with his tactics. Peace jan .

your posts are too long..I cant read them all. but i dont see any problem in what he did.. play by the rules, die by the rules!

After time for reflection, I am just a little bit embarrassed by the way I've posted on this thread. I had a real go at one of the very best players on here, (onua 0767), and would like to apologise to him. I hope the moderators will allow me to name him, so that I can say sorry. He is a great tournament player (over 200 torny wins),and if I ever get to be anywhere near as good as him then i'll be happy. I watched him play a uk8 final against another top player on here, and it was the best I've ever seen anyone play on here - he played an awesome, flawless game. It was a mixture of watchfulness, but then deadly striking to pot everything in sight, when he had the chance. I feel I did raise some interesting points, but this was clouded by naming and (trying) to shame a fellow player, and a great one at that. I would advise anyone not to post when angry, but wait and reflect beforehand, which is what I will do in future. I love this site, and am going to give it my all but, try to enjoy it more, win or lose.

walker666: Good post, glad to hear it :)

alhusky: No worries - not by business as a mod on this particular forum, but in general I don't think naming in a context like this should be a problem at all. After all, we openly use names in a lot of other positive contexts all the time.

You did raise a debate that is healthy, I'll give you that. In this case I think it has a pretty clear, one-way conclusion tho, but that doesn't mean it's stupid or wrong to bring up the point in the first place.

Thanks Jan, I appreciate it.